The negotiations regarding the UK’s withdrawal from the EU have got off to a less than auspicious start. It was interesting to read one reader’s comment on today’s Telegraph View, recounted here.

The Telegraph View

‘The UK must be prepared to walk away from the Brexit negotiations without a deal (Note: Moraymint said as much here on Article 50 day). This week, Theresa May made a perfectly reasonable, even conciliatory, opening gambit to the EU. The EU has replied with insults and threats to the future of Gibraltar. If its goal is to tie us up in ridiculous distractions for two years, and even dictate the kind of economy that we will have after leaving, then Mrs May must make it clear that Britain would rather walk than talk.’

The Telegraph then expounded on this opening paragraph before finishing by saying that ‘when it comes to Brexit negotiations, the Prime Minister’s tone has been correct: fair but firm. Britain does not want to damage the EU; the Government has stated that it wants cooperation and good neighbourliness. But if the EU insists on punishing, humiliating, dictating and denying the UK the very economic freedoms it has been fighting for, then Britain must say goodbye. The rest of the world is waiting – and it glitters with untapped potential.’

Mr Paul Berks’ View

A commenter by the name of Paul Berks then had this to say. ‘The only realistic position for the UK is to make a clean break, and now. We don’t need any transitional arrangements and we certainly don’t need any threats and further uncertainty. I spend my life negotiating and one thing is clear: if it is impossible to agree a win-win, then you have to walk away.

In this case, a win-win will be almost impossible to achieve owing to the misaligned interests of the 27 EU member nations and the political uber-class which rules them. We must be confident and secure in our choice to exercise our inalienable right to freedom and self-determination. With this approach, sense might prevail as the consequences become clear to the 27, and with the uber-class of Eurocrats getting overruled. However, if sense doesn’t prevail – so what?

The reason there is all this posturing around a payday is that the EU is bankrupt and so it aims to secure our taxpayers’ money to fund its black hole of subsidies and bureaucracy. Tell me, how is the EU going to collect on a bill which has no substance, no merit and no legal standing?

The EU has built layer upon layer of legislative and judicial protection for their soviet-style system to give them a semblance of democracy – but in fact it is a corrupt, cronyist system unmatched in history. We must not acknowledge or participate further in any of their charades as this only fuels the fire of dictatorship.

The Brexit process is partisan, flawed and illegal. Let’s just stick up two fingers and say enough is enough.’

Moraymint’s View

Hear, hear!


  1. […] via BREXIT: AND WE’RE OFF (TRACK ALREADY) — Moraymint Chatter […]


  2. Robert E Lee · ·

    Sadly, the ‘uber-class’ rulers of the 27 to which the author refers, also permeate Westminster too. I’ve just re-read ‘The Abolition of Liberty? and ‘The Broken Compass.? Both by Peter Hitchens and both excellent in style and readability but terminally depressing in content. As if that wasn’t enough I read 56 depressing pages (no more than a thick pamphlet), by A W Montford—‘The Propaganda Bureau.’ A searing indictment of our National broadcaster and an expose of its political bias.
    It would appear we’re driving ourselves to hell in a hand-cart.
    To cap it all, I live in bloody Spain! As was opined in Bill Forsyth’s superb film ‘Local Hero’—-“Interesting times Archie. Interesting times.”

    Liked by 3 people

    1. moraymint · ·

      Don’t get me going on the BBC Robert (albeit I had a pop at them in another reply below)! On the matter of BBC bias in relation to the EU Referendum and its result you may wish to read this depressing analysis from News-watch:

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Robert E Lee · ·

        Thankyou for the link MM. I skimmed something similar during the week indicating a bias of 4:1 in favour of remainers v leavers in BBC ‘interviews’. Scandalous!
        FWIW, if you haven’t perused Mountford’s work (Propaganda Bureau), it details five years worth of sleuthing involving the FOI act and the BBC’s obstruction and lies along the pathway in their support of the AGW cause. (So much for impartiality). The scale and depth of cover up is nothing short of astounding. Richard North is the only one who comes out of the debacle with credit (for nothing other than openness and truthfulness).

        Liked by 1 person

        1. Cheshireman · ·

          I know “AGW” is a side issue here, but there is a very telling graph of ice temperatures over the millennia as found within the Greenland ice sheet.

          Just google for ‘Greenland gisp2 ice core temperature last 10000 years’. All the lies and falsehoods to keep the gravy train running just winds me up so much.

          Liked by 1 person

  3. My Tory MP, Bob Blackman – Harrow East, was a Leave voter. Following the referendum I wrote asking what sort of deal he wanted with the EU – he replied that he wanted Hard Brexit.

    I’ve voted UKIP for many years but next time he’ll get my vote.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. moraymint · ·

      Regrettably, my MP is Angus Robertson SNP. Describing Robertson as neanderthal would be being generous to his persona. I’ve met him personally a few times and he is quite simply obnoxious – unless he senses there’s something in it for him not to be obnoxious.

      I’ve struggled somewhat with this ‘Hard/Soft Brexit’ terminology, invented as it was of course by the Remainians. My view is this. The EU Referendum was a binary choice: remain a signatory to the Treaty of Lisbon, or not. It’s like saying the choice was between 0 (Zero) or One (1). We chose One. Quite what makes a ‘Hard One’ as against a ‘Soft One’ is a bit beyond me. The decision was One. That’s it.

      Anyway, if your Tory MP is up for a ‘Hard Brexit’, we know what he means. Vote for him.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I believe that: Hard Brexit is being free of the EU with the exception of having to keep to their rules, regulations and specifications on what sell into the European market. Freedom to sell to other countries and set up trade and other deals with them, set our own tax rates and even, if we wish to ditch VAT and return to sales taxes etc. Ideally, Hard Brexit would also free us from the European Court of Justice.

        Soft Brexit is what the Remainers all want – able to sell to and import from the EU as present but no ability to set up trade deals with other countries, still subject to the European Court of Justice i.e. no change at all or we won the Referendum not you Leavers!

        I’m open to be corrected but I think this is what Farron, Clegg, Mandelson, Heseltine, Soubry, Major, Blair, Cameron, and all want.


  4. reallyoldbill · ·

    As a trading people by both instinct and history, of course we would like to achieve a satisfactory agreement with the EU upon Brexit, but to listen to the hysteria in some quarters about the consequences of leaving without one, something I am sure parliament would do its very best to refuse even to the point of remaining an EU member if it could, you would think that trade without such a treaty would stop. In fact of course our biggest single trading partner is the USA with which, surprise, surprise, we do not have a free trade treaty. Trade will continue in spite of everything, and certainly politics, because that is what trade does and always has. A trade agreement is desirable, but certainly not at any price. For too long the EU has used it as a Trojan Horse to impose political union across Europe and we have finally said “Enough”.

    It would seem that the EU leaders are convinced that, probably because of all the whining from the likes of Hesletine and his camp followers, the UK is desperate for such a deal and that they can therefore dictate terms, something echoed by the feint-hearted Lib Dems, Anna Soubry and the SNP among many others. Add to that the famous habit of the EU to spring an ambush in any negotiations, usually catching UK teams off guard, and I hope that Mrs May has the resolve required, not just to threaten to walk away but to actually do so. I have little doubt that the unnecessary inclusion of Gibraltar in the leaked minutes of the EU side is a blatant attempt to force concessions to Spanish fishing fleets who wish to exploit UK waters. That should be a flat “NO”. Recovering sovereignty means total recovery, including control of our borders, courts and law, and maritime areas. Anything less will not be Brexit and the government will pay a heavy price for failing to live up to its promises. My concern is that Mrs May, as home secretary, signed us up to things like Europol and the EU arrest warrant – something that takes away vital protection against arbitrary arrest without oversight by a British court which has existed (at least for the English) since 1215 – and is a declared fan of both. The omens are therefore not good.

    I sincerely hope that our government and negotiators can display the necessary resolve to convince the EU side that we will indeed walk away if they play fast and loose with us. We wish to be friends, but above all we wish to be free and sovereign. They would do well to consider the events of July 1940 when, after the French signed an armistice with the Germans, Churchill was worried that the powerful French fleet would fall into enemy hands. The Royal Navy blockaded it in port at Mers-el-Kebir and issued a clear ultimatum: either join us, sail to a safe foreign port in the USA or French West Indies to sit out the war, or scuttle yourselves. The French did not believe the British were serious and refused to comply. Most of the fleet was sunk under Royal Navy bombardment as a result. I hope the EU do not miscalculate our determination to succeed in the same way.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. moraymint · ·

      Good comment, Bill. I like that last point about the French Navy. The thing I’ve always admired about the British people is that we do have a reputation for tolerance and pragmatism. However, if we sniff injustice or chicanery, especially where those traits threaten our way of life, then the message is, ‘Don’t mess with the Brits’. The Euroelites would do well to consider this British trait borne of 1,000 years of history and hard-won freedoms …

      Liked by 1 person

  5. Whyayeman · ·

    Acrimonious divorces invariably end up in court and if that court is to be the ECJ then the outcome is preordained. Negotiating with deranged, vindictive bureaucrats, most of whom have far exceeded their true station in life is an exercise in futility.

    The EU is unravelling. When the ECB finally runs out of the wherewithal necessary to keep the plates spinning; when equity markets are finally seen for the mirage that they are; when it finally dawns on the Germans that they are most unlikely to ever see their huge Target2 balance being repaid; when the cost of sustaining millions of non-productive migrants can no longer be borne without increased taxation, then I suspect that European ‘solidarity’ will rapidly evaporate, to be replaced by mayhem.

    Paul Berks is right.

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Sorry, who is Paul Berk, MM?


    1. moraymint · ·

      All I have done here SM is pick up on a Telegraph subscriber by the name (or pen-name) of Paul Berks who commented on today’s Telegraph View online. Since the Telegraph is now only accessible thro’ a paywall, I decided to re-post the conversation here, with the appropriate credits.


  7. DICK R · ·

    Gibraltar needs to be re inforced

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Yes indeed, and our Navy strengthened to protect our home waters from illegal fishing when we recover our fishing grounds and home waters. We really need fast patrol ships and the coastguard to be expanded.

      Liked by 1 person

  8. Needless to say, whatever happens, I’m going to take immense satisfaction in not voting for my MP, Nick Clegg, at the next election. The BBC should be ashamed of bringing these euro-enthusiasts out onto the airwaves at every opportunity – they certainly don’t give balanced reporting.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. moraymint · ·

      Yes, it does seem odd. A democracy decides to take a course of action. The Government organises itself to implement the will of the people. The state broadcaster then trips over itself at every opportunity to hand the airwaves to the minority voice screaming that it is their avowed intention to subvert the will of the people. WTF?

      Turn this on its head. Imagine for a moment if the British people had voted Remain. Do you think that we would ever have heard again from what would have been the 16 million minority who wanted the UK to leave the EU? No, of course not, never; not in a thousand years. The BBC would not now be taking the slightest interest in any individual or group bleating after the Referendum that the UK should be leaving the EU, notwithstanding the result. The BBC’s editorial line would have been that the UK has voted to remain in the EU and that’s the end of the matter. The losing leavers would have been patronised from arsehole to breakfast time.

      Looking at it this way, one realises the blatant bias of the BBC under the present circumstances. It is quite extraordinary the extent to which the BBC is systematically channelling the ‘no-Brexit-at-any-cost’ message onto the airwaves. Another analogy would be as if during, say, WW2 the BBC had devoted massive amounts of time and resources to filling the airwaves with the Germans’ perspective on the war, all in the name of balanced reporting. Again, WTF? Bear in mind that the BBC is a taxpayer-funded, state broadcaster. It’s not supposed to be some sort of glorified, rebellious Radio Luxembourg, writ large.

      The British people have decided that the UK should leave the EU. To that extent the matter is closed; done and dusted. For the BBC to be giving disproportionate airtime to people who say, ‘NO, the UK should NOT be leaving the EU’ is a bizarre editorial attitude for a taxpayer-funded (oh, and EU-funded, of course), monopoly broadcaster. Oh, hang on a minute – a monopoly broadcaster in receipt of EU funds?

      Liked by 2 people

  9. I did enjoy Mr. Druncker’s recent rant and his laughable threat to help break up the United States. However underlying this is the view amongst these maniacs that Britain belongs to the EU. This is the message they are putting across. I am not sure how ths will play out. We have a great many would be traitors in our midst, both at home in Parliament, and abroad in the Foreign Office.

    However Mrs. May has surprised me. I know she gets a bad press for doing little at the Home Office, but realistticaly all the time we are subject to the rulings of the ECHR there was very little she could do. I think we will end up walking away because the EU overestimates its position and once its plain that they wont back down we will have no other option. Now that project fear has been shown to be hoax I think the people will not be so easily cowed.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. John Hatfield · ·

      I hope she doesn’t start making concessions to the EU which are undeserved. We certainly do not want to be paying for single market membership which would be little different to EU membership.
      We need to be prepared to walk away from the negotiations if the EU continues to be unreasonable. They owe us. Not the other way round.

      Liked by 2 people

    2. reallyoldbill · ·

      Unfortunately I can’t agree with your suggestion that Mrs May did little during her 6 years at the Home Office. In fact she did a great deal but little of it was positive. In particular she signed up to a good many EU initiatives on crime, policing and justice from which the UK had opt outs and should have kept. The European Arrest Warrant, far from being as she describes it a source of greater security for us, actually permits a UK citizen to be arrested by British police in their own country on the authority of a magistrate in a far off EU state which enjoys none of the legal safe-guards, sophisticated legal systems or probity of officials to which we are entitled to feel, as British citizens, subject. How exactly does that make us safer? It may be more administratively convenient for the authorities when dealing with cross border crime, but that is not at all the same thing, and the ancient legal safeguards that guarantee us a fair trial by an unbiased British court enshrined in English Common Law and Magna Carta were there for a reason, and should not have been casually discarded by a fickle politician in thrall to her special advisers. I suspect that the chances of this being a victim of Brexit under Mrs May’s hand will be virtually nil. That leads me to worry about what other EU remnants will be retained when we eventually leave.

      Liked by 2 people

  10. DeeDee99 · ·

    The EU is out to bully and humiliate us …. in order to scare the smaller nations it has trapped from contemplating their own departure. We should just walk away and offer to help any other nation which decides to do the same. Unfortunately, as the British Establishment wants the EU to hold together, Mrs May will put up with all the punishment-talk the Kommissars and Merkel dish out and will eventually settle for a bad deal. They simply haven’t got the guts to walk away.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. moraymint · ·

      I hate to say this, DeeDee, but right now I fear you’re right. I’m prepared to give the Government some slack for the time being, but it will become clear over the coming weeks whether walking away is genuinely an option within the Government’s armoury …

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I hope that the Government has the guts to walk away but there are plenty of people who will do anything they can to scupper it. You know the suspects – Blair, Mandelson, Heseltine, Soubry, Major, Gina Miller, Sturgeon and all – they are all for the European dictatorship rather than our country. It won’t be over until we are out. I’ve waited for 40 years, so can wait a bit longer but if the suspects frustrate it there will be hell to pay.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. moraymint · ·

          Yes, I have this niggling sense that the Continuity Remain brigade are underestimating seriously the consequences of them succeeding in somehow reversing the Brexit process with the result that, to all intents and purpose, the UK remained in the EU, or somehow otherwise bound by vast tracts of the Treaty of Lisbon.

          If such a scenario did unfold, I think that there would indeed be hell to pay. I’ve never to taken to a street protest for anything in my life. However, if it transpired that British democracy got shafted on the altar of creating a European superstate, not only would I be on the streets, you’d see me in the vanguard.

          That so many people seem to be so hell-bent on having this country governed by a corrupt, foreign oligarchy is the source of enormous mystery to me …

          Liked by 1 person

          1. “That so many people seem to be so hell-bent on having this country governed by a corrupt, foreign oligarchy is the source of enormous mystery to me …”

            Unfortunately,it seems that a certain depth of life experience is required to grasp the simple answer when it’s presented!

            I’ve been following MM since before GE of May ’15 and to me this shouldn’t be hard for his readers.

            Epigenetics.. more specifically
            “r/K (r vs K) selection theory”
            (the reproductive strategies of the ‘r’ and ‘K’ selected Genesets)
            The whole of Human History can be viewed through this lens and it appears to hold good?

            For the theory, Visit

            see also Stefan Molyneux’s “Truth about Gene wars: r/K Selection Theory”

            (Part 1 of 3)

            Everything we are watching in politics is driven by this fight for reproductive success.

            To these ‘r’emainiacs it is LITERALLY their Geneset that is threatened. . From their perspective.. So their reactions aren’t that surprising really…

            subconsciously we all know that the future of our Genes is at stake here, don’t we?

            Keep up the good work MM.

            Liked by 1 person

            1. P.s.

              “Internal ‘r’ (Liberals) prefer External ‘r’ (migrants) to Internal ‘K’ (Brexiteers/Trumpinators)”

              Liked by 1 person

            2. Re: my first comment above,

              That link to the blog
     is essential reading for the r/K take on current events.

              For the theory I meant to leave…

              Either way… I hope this helps.

              Liked by 1 person


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